Software Spotlight

Michael Bernzweig (00:02.546)
Are you ready to unlock the secrets of B2B SaaS success? Tired of sifting through endless noise to find actionable insights that actually move the needle?

Welcome to Software Spotlight, your weekly deep dive into the transformative world of Software-as-a-Service. Your host is Michael Bernzweig, who in 1998 launched Software Oasis as one of the first platforms enabling businesses to download, license, and deploy software instantly across their networks with a single click. Today, Software Oasis has evolved into one of the leading communities where businesses find top tech consultants across the USA and Canada.

Each week, Michael sits down with industry titans, innovative leaders, and game-changing executives to bring you exclusive insights you won't find anywhere else. From emerging technologies to market trends, Software Spotlight delivers the strategic intelligence you need to accelerate your SaaS career and stay ahead of the curve.

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I'd like to welcome everyone to today's edition of the Software Spotlight. Joining us today is Amber Gage, the founder of Far Beyond Marketing and creator of the Far Beyond Marketing online course. With over a decade of experience in digital marketing, Amber has helped numerous businesses achieve remarkable growth through her innovative strategies and deep understanding of consumer behavior.

Amber Gaige (00:16.186)
Yes.

Michael Bernzweig (00:29.574)
So with that, Amber, welcome to the software spotlight.

Amber Gaige (00:31.216)
Hi Michael, it's such a privilege to be here. Thanks for having me.

Michael Bernzweig (00:36.496)
Yeah, no, fantastic. And I really appreciate your sharing a few of your nuggets of wisdom over the years with our audience. We have a lot of executives and founders and all of that that are listening. marketing is something that touches every aspect of every business. And it's so important. So I was hoping maybe we could start off for any of our listeners that may not be familiar with you or your organization.

If you could share a little bit about your personal journey and a little bit about what Far Beyond Marketing is all about.

Amber Gaige (01:12.002)
Absolutely. That'd be my pleasure. So I came from very humble beginnings in the South. My family goes back 208 years in the great state of Texas. So we were here before the Alamo to put it in perspective. our roots go deep and I grew up as a plumber's kid. My dad is a contractor and my mother has three business degrees. And so I grew up in a family business with older brothers.

Michael Bernzweig (01:26.834)
I love it.

Amber Gaige (01:40.874)
and it was the school of hard knocks. Half of my education was traditional education, school, et cetera, and the other half was entrepreneurship. So by the time that I was 16 and had finished high school, I knew very well how to run a business because of having multiple exposures to family business growing up. Fast forward to that after graduating from Baylor, Sickenbeers.

I ended up coming home and working in the family businesses again, where I started our marketing department. And that was back in the early 2000s, Michael, where the internet was still finding its sea legs and everything was ranking on the first page. And we had all these options and we were still balancing yellow pages alongside the digital marketing. And so that was a lot of fun. And I found myself really drawn to the analytics of marketing.

Michael Bernzweig (02:21.917)
Sure.

Amber Gaige (02:36.078)
the numbers game, what actually moved the needle and translated into real time sales for our family businesses. Guess I had a little bit of success in doing that because I ended up starting my own lead generation company and scaling it about five years. So started in 2013, selling it in 2018. And then thank you. was a, it was a fun ride. And then I got to spend quite a bit of time doing national marketing for private equity.

Michael Bernzweig (02:55.976)
Congratulations.

Amber Gaige (03:05.454)
and venture capitalists and helping other companies grow. But my heart is still for the entrepreneurs, for those founders, for those dreamers, making sure that our local economy is really, really strong and protecting people from marketing that's just quite frankly a waste of money. Because in my opinion, Michael, the science and the data is what tells the story. Numbers don't lie.

Michael Bernzweig (03:28.964)
Absolutely. And, you know, in speaking before the episode, I can hear that our journey, you know, to where we are, you know, parallels one another in terms of having some of that background in family business, being early on on the internet, and obviously connecting with all different stakeholders in marketing. So it's really exciting to hear.

I'll share with you one early story. You mentioned phone books there. And back in 1995, obviously, there were many phone books out there. And one phone book that I encountered early on was at a trade show right here in Boston at the World Trade Center.

Amber Gaige (03:53.85)
your life.

Michael Bernzweig (04:12.286)
four guys were standing behind a booth and they had spent the entire summer from 94 until 95 cataloging every single internet company they could find on the internet and putting it into what looked like a phone book. And their great idea was they were gonna sell advertising in these phone books. And I said to myself, wow, that's interesting. That was Jerry Yang over at Yahoo. And there were literally eight people in the company at that time.

Amber Gaige (04:42.382)
Wow, what a story! That is so cool!

Michael Bernzweig (04:44.548)
Isn't that crazy? But no, I noticed that, you know, in preparing for the episode that you have what you like to call your four C's of effective marketing. And I was hoping maybe you could share some of that blueprint and strategy with our audience just to give everyone a feeling for how that all fits together.

Amber Gaige (04:57.509)
Yeah.

Amber Gaige (05:08.616)
absolutely. So when I work with new clients, I so oftentimes encounter situations where they don't know why their marketing is ineffective. They're spending a lot of money, but it isn't moving the needle. And so the creation of my book and my online course based on the four C's of marketing was out of necessity because I found myself repeating the same thing over and over again. So when you have a synergistic relationship between these four areas of marketing,

then you're pretty much guaranteed at least a 10X return on your marketing dollars spent. So the first C of marketing is clear copy. What are you saying? Is your messaging clear? I love the Donald Miller approach. I'm actually one of only 600 people in the world to hold his certification as a story brand guide. When we tell a story that draws our potential clients in, we annihilate the competition and people listen to us. But

Michael Bernzweig (05:58.376)
Sure.

Amber Gaige (06:06.936)
It's sadly one of the most overlooked areas of marketing, Michael. People don't think about their story. They only think about cramming their transactional opportunities down people's throat. And that's just the wrong way to go about it. Do you agree?

Michael Bernzweig (06:12.359)
Great.

Michael Bernzweig (06:18.942)
I absolutely do. you know, on that same note, I remember in my college years, you know, you have so many textbooks and you're like, I'm just going to toss all of these, I'm out of here. But the one textbook that I kept was Michael Porter's strategy on marketing. And to this day, I mean, just so many nuggets of information in there that are still relevant, you know, whether it's an offline world of marketing or online, you know, a lot of the fundamentals are there, but I'll let you continue.

So sounds like we've got that first C down.

Amber Gaige (06:52.174)
Yeah, yeah, that first C is one of those fundamentals that you talked about. And that's a great book, by the way. I know exactly what book you're talking about. Yeah. The second C is consistent branding. It isn't enough just to have a logo if people cannot find you multiple times. The latest statistic, I think, is that it takes someone 11 interactions with your brand before they take a single action themselves. So are you consistently branding?

Michael Bernzweig (06:59.578)
Sure, sure.

Amber Gaige (07:20.236)
I like to tell my clients that this is like a chocolate layer cake. If you just put your brand out there one time, you're not going to get any bites. But if you layer your branding consistently across multiple channels, then you are increasing your opportunities exponentially for people to find you and do business with you. So frequency overreach is a huge aspect. And that's the second C, consistent branding.

Michael Bernzweig (07:45.488)
Okay, that makes a lot of sense. And you know, I would think, you know, it doesn't matter, you know, your current product market fit or what it is you're doing, you know, keeping a consistent brand, you know, through all of your years of marketing is probably the one element that ties everything together.

Amber Gaige (07:54.096)
Thank you.

Amber Gaige (08:04.632)
It is and that leads me to the third C which is the customer demographic. If you're marketing in the wrong places then you're not going to attract people that will move the needle forward for your business. So consistently branding in front of people who are most likely to do business with you. Doing the deep dive of your customer analysis. Finding out who it is that's actually paying you.

I like to tell people that the more niched you are, the more you can charge. But it also requires some work and some data science to go through and determine who your target customer actually is. And a lot of people don't realize that with AI and with the technology that we have, it is so easy to do a reverse data appendage to find out who your customers are, where they live, what their buying habits are. And again, it's an overlooked opportunity so frequently.

If you spend a little bit of money to find out who your customers are, where they are, and what's driving them to make decisions, well now you can blend your message with your branding and go use the right bait for the right fish, you know?

Michael Bernzweig (09:15.024)
Makes sense, makes sense. And I think a lot of businesses sometimes lose sight of just that point. I mean, I think it's so easy to get caught up in the day-to-day of the focus of whatever your business is all about and to lose sight of the marketing strategy.

Amber Gaige (09:34.116)
Well, and we think we have to serve everyone. And in reality, we don't. Not everyone is your customer. I know when we're starting out a business, we're all hungry for new leads. But at the same time, as you refine your offering and you refine your products and service, you need to be able to say no. Otherwise, you're just wasting resources.

Michael Bernzweig (09:49.19)
Yeah, you need to be able, yeah, you need to define your ICP really, really precisely and to zero in like a laser on exactly who you're trying to reach, what your messaging is and all of that. Otherwise here, it's a spray and pray effect like you were talking about and you're just wasting money.

Amber Gaige (10:10.874)
just wasting money and then accounting's yelling at you and operations is frustrated because no one's getting leads and it's just not a pretty cycle. So we just need to avoid that by working smarter, not harder, right? So the final C is channel management. Are you set up in such a way that you can consistently deliver your product or service again and again and again to your clients? And it's so much less expensive to upsell a current client than it is to go find a new one. So.

Michael Bernzweig (10:20.904)
Sure.

Amber Gaige (10:38.768)
Is your messaging, is your branding, is your customer demographic? Are you communicating consistently? Are you focusing on your sales channels? Is your sales funnel really intact? Where's the exit lane of how people are falling out of your funnels and how can you plug those holes? Your channel management, at least what I refer to it in my book, is a very simplified ideology that we should have a system in place to consistently

be serving our clients with more products and services to keep them loyal to us. This could be a subscription-based model. This could be an upsell opportunity. This could be an add-on. But channel management is a huge avenue when you're talking about sustaining the revenue for a company.

Michael Bernzweig (11:25.662)
Sure, and a lot of organizations, I think, lose sight of that. your cost of acquiring each new customer is probably one of the biggest expenses in any marketing campaign, but the reality of it is all of the customers that you already have are your, they already know you, they already like you, they already trust you. They're the best opportunity to expand your offerings and upsell and cross-selling.

and all of that and so that's amazing. lot of, I think a lot of businesses lose sight of that and that's a really, really key point. So are many of the...

businesses that you're working with, you know, at Far Beyond, mostly small to mid-sized businesses, enterprise level clients, local businesses, national businesses, organizations, or check all of the above. Who is it that you're reaching?

Amber Gaige (12:21.744)
We have a healthy mix. really do. We find ourselves working with mostly mid sector businesses, companies, probably a million dollars annual gross rev, maybe 50 employees somewhere in there. We also do a lot of consulting for national brands, franchisors who are looking for a synergistic relationship of national branding and localized presence.

Michael Bernzweig (12:38.504)
Sure.

Amber Gaige (12:48.176)
When you're talking about marketing for franchising, that's a whole other animal. Another target demographic for us is second generation businesses. We recognize that those leaders who have come up through the ranks are recognizing the opportunity themselves for smarter marketing, utilizing AI, utilizing data science. They already have a strong brand in place, but they're ready to really pour the gasoline in and get this company up to the next level. So we serve a lot of those clients as well.

Michael Bernzweig (12:52.167)
Yes.

Michael Bernzweig (13:17.478)
Yeah. And that that's exciting. You know, I mean, so many first generation businesses never make it to that second generation, but the ones that do just, just case in point, like you said, really are savvy with the tech and ready to bring things up to the next level. But, and it's, so unfortunate that so few businesses make it to that third generation. That's really, really challenging. But I think with the right foundation, obviously, things can get there. was listening to

an episode of the Mars dynasty and that whole multi-generational business and you know just case in point you know if it's done correctly it can far outlive the original family so that's amazing. I guess that you know and I want to pull on one thread but how did the framework that you're talking about here inspire you to

Amber Gaige (14:06.383)
Yes.

Michael Bernzweig (14:16.35)
create the online course that you're making available to businesses and organizations.

Amber Gaige (14:24.046)
You know, it was really multifaceted, Michael. There were a couple of different scenarios that awakened me to the fact that we needed to empower people with the opportunity to learn the four C's of marketing and put it to work in their businesses. Number one, as we said earlier, not everyone is your customer. So not everyone has the ability to hire an agency to do it for them. But again, I'm a plumber's kid.

Michael Bernzweig (14:47.664)
Right.

Amber Gaige (14:50.128)
And I have a passion for the little guys and I want people to achieve their dream, the American dream of launching their businesses. And so even if you're a startup, a 250 and $300 investment is an opportunity to have the tactics of marketing at your fingertips, go through the course, you get access to it for a year and be able to put these things into place quickly on a foundational level so that you can avoid the pitfalls.

that so many new business owners fall into. So that was my heart's cry number one, to support the little guy.

Michael Bernzweig (15:23.814)
Yeah, and it sounds like years of knowledge and wisdom that brought you to this point where you were able to bottle all of that in one concise strategy and course.

Amber Gaige (15:31.022)
you

Amber Gaige (15:34.86)
yeah, I'm no spring chicken. I've been doing this for over 25 years now, Michael. So it's been a long journey. But so that's, was client number one. Client number two is the busy marketing director of these larger companies who is onboarding, maybe interns, onboarding a marketing manager. Maybe it's a family owned company whose cousin's sister's aunt is doing social media and they don't know how to tell her that what she's doing isn't working. Well, we wanted to provide the marketing directors with the ability to train.

Michael Bernzweig (15:37.971)
I love it. I love it.

Amber Gaige (16:03.802)
people on how to market effectively. So that's another opportunity to use the course.

Michael Bernzweig (16:09.798)
I love it. And you also mentioned some consultant. Is that something that Far Beyond is doing for a segment of clients?

Amber Gaige (16:11.886)
mentions consultant.

Yes, yes, I find myself doing a lot of consulting. I've had the privilege of consulting with several national brands, helping them to really hone their strategy, bring in story brand.

Amber Gaige (16:32.145)
are we back? Okay, bring in story brand, bring in that cohesiveness between branding and copy. So we love to do strategic consulting.

Michael Bernzweig (16:32.848)
Yeah, yeah, then we're here.

Michael Bernzweig (16:44.326)
Makes sense. And you know, you've obviously seen the overall of those years, a lot of changes in the digital landscape, you know, whether it's SEO or SEM or different kinds of marketing. How does this framework apply as changes and things like that happen within the landscape of marketing? it hold true and consistent or does it evolve?

Amber Gaige (16:59.28)
I do think it holds true. I think we have to have a true north. think that while the tactics of marketing will of course shift with business needs, business growth, industry,

you're always going to have tactics, but then you're always going to need to align tactics underneath an overarching strategy. And when we come in and we work with a company on their marketing, so often we find the elements of these four C's are already present, but they may not be working cohesively together. And so whether we need to work on just the messaging or whether we need to figure out the customer demographic.

or whether we need to create a beautiful new brand strategy, when we get that cohesiveness aligned, the company thrives. We see the results tangibly, usually within about 120 days at the most. So I do think it holds true, but I think you have to look at it on a nuanced perspective as well.

Michael Bernzweig (18:12.542)
Yeah, and I love what you said at the beginning of the episode where you were talking about data and the analytics and all of that and how important it is to be able to create strategy based on tangible data. So what I was hoping, and obviously AI is, everyone is thinking about AI. One of the things I was hoping we could touch on,

Amber Gaige (18:23.312)
of pre-made strategy based on tangible data. So what I was hoping, and obviously AI is everyone's instinctive of AI. One of the things I was hoping to touch on with AI, a lot of organizations just think, hey, AI can write things, great phrases and copy and strategies and things like that, but I think the importance of AI for-

Michael Bernzweig (18:39.794)
with AI, lot of organizations are saying, AI can write all of these great phrases and copy and strategies and things like that. But I think the importance of AI for analyzing data is under looked and so many organizations are not utilizing that tech. What are your thoughts on AI and data analysis?

Amber Gaige (18:51.536)
I think if we're not embracing it, then we're behind the times. think AI analysis has a huge part to play in marketing. I think that there will always be a need for humans to oversee and manage AI.

But yes, put AI to work for you by all means. Makes sense. I think that's really important. So you've seen a lot of organizations, and you've probably seen a lot of common mistakes. How can these first piece of health businesses avoid those benefits? Yeah. Well, as my daddy always said, if you begin with the end in mind, if you begin with the end in mind,

Michael Bernzweig (19:25.862)
Makes sense, no, and I think that's really important. So, you you've seen a lot of different organizations and you've probably seen a lot of common mistakes that you see businesses making. How can these four Cs help businesses avoid those pitfalls?

Amber Gaige (19:50.362)
then you have clarity about where you're going. And so you can avoid pitfalls and common mistakes by getting a plan and by following a plan. So if you know who you are as a company, if you know your story, if you know who you serve, and if you know where those people are or where those companies are, now you are laser focused. It is not the spray tactic.

It is the hone it in, get the site scale scaled in. we say in Texas, it's deer season down here in the South. So, you know, we're, we're hunting with scopes down here, but, it's, it's focusing your efforts and not throwing it up against the wall and seeing if it sticks. No one, no one likes to gamble with company resources, especially when it's them being put on being held accountable for it. know, obviously we're in strategy and the whole concept of is very, know, to where you need.

Michael Bernzweig (20:28.999)
Hello.

Michael Bernzweig (20:43.078)
And obviously brand strategy and the whole concept is very, you know, it's a very unique group of consultants that are involved with brand strategy and the brand story. Can you talk a little bit more about that?

Amber Gaige (20:50.144)
of consultants that are involved in brand strategy and brand story.

Well, in one aspect, mean, brand strategy is certainly contingent upon your customer demographic, the company growth goals, the perceive, the perceivment of the branding in general in a market. So there's a lot of avenues we could discuss in brand strategy. Yeah, no, just just at a high level, know, focusing on the brand story is going to bring to these organizations that they're getting the message. 100%. Yes. I mean,

Michael Bernzweig (21:14.78)
Yeah, no, just at a high level, know, what, you know, focusing on the brand story is going to bring to these organizations as they're getting their messaging out there.

Amber Gaige (21:27.926)
your brand story sets the tone, sets the mission, sets the importance of where your company is going and who you're serving. So I've seen brand strategy shift. mean, Geico is a great example of that, right? They have different creative for different demographics for different products that they sell. You know, they've got the middle age, they've got the younger ones. And that's all part of the story branding as well, making the applicable message heard.

Michael Bernzweig (21:46.886)
Sure.

Amber Gaige (21:56.26)
to that target audience so that that target audience relates back to what you're saying. You can't talk to everybody the same way, right? I can't talk to my seven year old the same way I talk to my husband. It's just not gonna compute. It's the same thing with brand strategy. Know who you wanna connect with and then set your tone, set your story, set your messaging to those individuals. And of course it has to fall underneath the overarching aspect of the company, brand and the products and services and niche market that you're in.

Michael Bernzweig (22:08.871)
Right.

Amber Gaige (22:25.668)
But yeah, it's basically a universal clarity giver when you focus on your strategy.

Michael Bernzweig (22:31.634)
So I guess what might be helpful for the audience, can you give an example of kind of a day in the life of maybe either a consulting client or maybe a small business that has gone through the course and what life maybe looked like before versus after for them in terms of some of the measurable or tangible changes from what they were doing before until after?

Amber Gaige (22:58.286)
Yeah, absolutely. So for an example, we have a client who is a second generation family business, multiple, multiple, I can't say that word multiple. There we go. Let's say that again, multiple entities, all in home services, but multiple brands and in a large geographic area serving millions of population. When we started consulting with

Michael Bernzweig (23:07.676)
Ha

Michael Bernzweig (23:13.768)
Thank you.

Amber Gaige (23:25.328)
the organization, we uncovered the fact that they were being sold a bill of goods that wasn't actually moving their company forward. They were being told to invest thousands and thousands of dollars of SEO. They were told that just by getting inbound traffic to their website that they were growing. But unfortunately, 2023, 2024 showed differently. It showed that Americans were getting very concerned.

and nervous about the economy and they were not investing the level that they were in the home services sector. And so what we did was we ran an analysis on the year over year growth for that company. We saw that sales were actually declining versus the increased amount of marketing that they were spending. We then delved in deeper to the SEO tactics and the search terms that were being used only to figure out that

they were not being given localized traffic. Traffic was being driven from all over the United States, but not necessarily within their areas of service. So more traffic was not great, it just meant more traffic and it certainly wasn't translating into more sales. Then we cross analyzed that with the search terms that were being done in their particular industry and we found that consumer confidence was showing more of a DIY than a do it for me pattern.

So at the end of the day, we devised a new strategy where we were able to bring in new vendor partners, revise search tactics and different products and services and calls to action that help the consumer with lower ticket opportunities. And the company has seen a great turnaround financially over the last about four months.

Michael Bernzweig (25:20.658)
Yeah, and I think so many organizations lose sight of the fact that just that, more traffic is not necessarily better. It's the right traffic, the targeted traffic that's relevant for what their offering is. I think the other detail that's important, which a lot of organizations either don't realize or may have been less important in the days of old,

Amber Gaige (25:23.376)
...

Amber Gaige (25:35.632)
and the other things that I would like to see.

Michael Bernzweig (25:47.826)
Having optimized landing pages and optimized funnels and all of that to drive traffic to your desired outcome, whether it's a sign up or a...

a free trial or a purchase or book a meeting or whatever it is. In earlier days, just getting somebody to your website, there were so few competitors that it was fine. everyone's become so much more sophisticated nowadays.

Amber Gaige (26:10.896)
is just getting somebody to do a website for the social competitors that is following. Everyone's becoming much more sophisticated about this. Well, and not only, you're exactly right, Michael, about driving the traffic and optimizing your landing page, but let's take it a step further when it comes to data science and analysis. We now have the ability to track real-time activity on a website. We know what campaigns people are coming from.

what pages they're landing on, how much time they're spending on these pages, and what calls to action they're interacting with. When you have that kind of analysis at your fingertips as a business operator, you're able to make all kinds of insightful decisions about your product offerings and services. But instead, so many business owners today are still being held hostages by website they can't even control or change.

let alone know where their traffic's coming from or how much time people are spending on their pages. Google Analytics is not the end all be all. They just want us to think that it is. But we don't have to rely on Google for retroactive information. We can get it in real time on the websites now.

Michael Bernzweig (27:17.747)
Thanks.

Michael Bernzweig (27:22.428)
Yeah, and it's crazy, I would agree with you there. So many businesses, you know, we're obviously needing the strategy and the insight, but also the implementation. When you're working with clients, are you able to help them, you know, either partner with companies that you've worked with that can do the implementation, or do you provide some of that, or how do you work with them?

Amber Gaige (27:27.448)
We do. We do. We're a full service marketing agency, so pretty much anything that they need, we can do.

But again, we don't want to be everything to everyone. So if there is a super, super specific need with over 25 years in the industry, I have a very tight knit group of pre vetted vendor partners that I work with that I can deliver to my clients and say, okay, these people are exact specialists for this niche of marketing deliverables. But for the most part, with my team, we're able to

implement pretty much anything that a client needs or wants. Absolutely. And I'll tell them where to go to do it too.

Michael Bernzweig (28:24.232)
Got it. And for some of the listeners that are saying, wow, this all sounds interesting and sounds like something that really applies to our business. Can you give our listeners a few actionable tips from the 4C's that you think would enhance their marketing efforts? a little bit of a sneak peek.

Michael Bernzweig (28:46.216)
Sure.

Amber Gaige (28:46.672)
So if you go to my website, farbeyondmarketing.com, you'll see a menu at the top that says a toolkit for entrepreneurs. One of the great links in that toolkit is a link of a story brand assessment. I recommend every business owner click that link and be able to see and identify what parts of your story are currently clear and what parts might need a little love. So that's a great tip. That's underneath.

Michael Bernzweig (29:13.182)
That's a great starting point, absolutely. And we'll leave a link in the show notes so that people can get there easily.

Amber Gaige (29:15.12)
Yes, absolutely,

Michael Bernzweig (29:23.548)
I love it. you know, obviously you sit in a really unique spot, having been in the industry for years and understanding where things are at and moving. What do you see as to the future of marketing as far as, you know, the evolution of a lot of these different changes? What do you see happening in the years to come?

Amber Gaige (29:40.656)
I think business owners and operators are going and decision makers are going to continue to become more savvy when it comes to marketing and they are going to demand more from their marketing partners. I see an increased level of transparency given the ability to harness AI and data science and I see less and less of the

former years of throw it up with the wall and see if it sticks. let's just sprinkle some magic fairy dust and see if this works. I think we're going to be able to use our data analysis to make an impact faster than ever before. And that's exciting. That's where the fun stuff comes in, Michael.

Michael Bernzweig (30:28.816)
I love it and that's what it's all about. if you were to leave everyone with one piece of advice that you give to entrepreneurs looking to kind of elevate their marketing game, what would that big piece of advice be?

Amber Gaige (30:38.064)
Demand transparency and control from any marketing partner that you work with. You should own and control your digital assets. They should be in your name. You should own and control your website. You should know you should have the ability to hire and fire vendors at will and know your message.

Who are you, who do you serve, and how does your product or service make life better for your clients?

Michael Bernzweig (31:12.962)
I love it. Well, that's great. And I think it's packed with, I think we've covered a lot of ground. think we've provided some really actionable insight for a lot of the businesses listening to this podcast. really appreciate your time on the software spotlight today and Amber Gage over at Far Beyond Marketing. Thank you so much for your time.

Amber Gaige (31:22.064)
It was so much fun being here Michael you have a great day